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**Fats in the Cats Position on Unauthorized Trail Building**

 
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GoneToTheDogs?



Joined: 21 Sep 2006
Posts: 418
Location: Kingston

PostPosted: Tue Apr 07, 2009 11:02 pm    Post subject: **Fats in the Cats Position on Unauthorized Trail Building** Reply with quote

The construction of unauthorized trails threatens the future of our sport.

Public lands and preserves have become treasured resources that require careful management. Government agencies have a responsibility to administer public lands to meet a wide range of needs. Trails created without permission compromise the land manager's ability to meet these needs.

Fats in the Cats absolutely does not support building unauthorized trails.
Depending on the jurisdiction, the building of unauthorized trails can be a violation or result in criminal charges. Recently, some individuals in the region were charged with building unauthorized trails and face legal action.

Improving mountain bike trail access involves cooperative work with the people who manage the land. Gaining legal trail access can be a complex and time-consuming process, but it has paid great dividends for mountain bikers. Trail access is directly related to solid relations between mountain bikers and land managers. Government officials and Land Managers look to mountain bikers and local clubs for solutions to improving trails, while balancing increased population pressures and environmental concerns.

Fats in the Cats is prominently featured as a partner with the NYS DEC in the Catskill Park State Land Master Plan. We also have active relationships with land managers and advocates including DEC Region 3, the National Park Service in Hyde Park, the Winnakee Land Trust, Hyde Park Recreation Commission, D&H Corridor Alliance, NYS Office of Parks and Historic Preservation, the Open Space Institute, the Woodstock Land Conservancy, Scenic Hudson, and Vassar College.

The construction of unauthorized trails undermines this process - not only because it defies the spirit of cooperation but also poses environmental uncertainties. Most trails are planned and built as part of a master plan that considers multiple factors. Unauthorized trails - while often carefully built - may threaten habitat, plants and trees and increase erosion. Renegade trails hurt the vast majority of mountain bikers who have never even considered building an unauthorized trail.

Popular trail networks can be at risk of being closed to mountain bikers because land managers didn't have resources to curtail the construction of unauthorized trails. Fats in the Cats opposes building or altering trails or structures without land manager permission.

We hope to offer solutions to mountain bikers and land managers. We want to help build technical, challenging trails, where appropriate. We want to encourage the construction of logical trail connectors. The future of mountain biking in our region depends on cooperation with land managers.

Mountain bikers and land managers should work together to determine who the users are and what needs should be met. This way trails can be designed that are sustainable and appealing to everyone. When mountain bikers build trails without permission, it hurts the sport's credibility. "Renegade" trailbuilders need to come forward and work cooperatively with land managers.

The best way to keep existing trails open and to develop new trails is to establish and maintain respectful and professional cooperation with land managers.

An increase in unauthorized trailbuilding by mountain bikers could threaten these partnerships.

It is impossible for everyone's recreation needs to be met at all locations all the time. There have to be some compromises. Folks need to be patient and work within the system. A solid professional relationship between mountain bikers and land managers is the key to getting new trails.

There are varied protocol for different areas in order to propose, build, and maintain trails. Fats in the Cats will strive to make that information available to regional cyclists.

On behalf of the Board of Directors of Fats in the Cats
April 7, 2009
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bike this



Joined: 13 Nov 2006
Posts: 1166
Location: YKYO

PostPosted: Wed Apr 08, 2009 12:41 pm    Post subject: Re: **Fats in the Cats Position on Unauthorized Trail Buildi Reply with quote

GoneToTheDogs? wrote:
The construction of unauthorized trails threatens the future of our sport.

Recently, some individuals in the region were charged with building unauthorized trails and face legal action.



Anybody we know. Question Question
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GoneToTheDogs?



Joined: 21 Sep 2006
Posts: 418
Location: Kingston

PostPosted: Wed Apr 08, 2009 3:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hey Tommy,

I don't think that it's appropriate to put the individuals' names on this public forum under any circumstances. In addition the case is pending in the court system. If names do show up, moderators should redact them.

The main thing to take away from this is that we need to continue to have positive open lines of communication with Land Managers and user groups and not engage in any trail projects without expressed permission of the respective Land Manager.

A Trail User's Summit has been discussed with DEC Region 3 which covers the Lower Hudson Valley including Ulster, Orange, Dutchess, Putnam, Westchester, Sullivan and Rockland Counties. When the time is right, we may try to get together representatives of all regional Mountain Bike Clubs, Bike Shops, Land managers, other user groups etc. as part of an educational program about recreational use of State Land.

Russ
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slave2bacon



Joined: 17 Oct 2006
Posts: 789
Location: Beautiful Ulster Park

PostPosted: Thu Apr 09, 2009 12:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The trail users summit is a great idea. Seems like that would be a good way to get some ideas where new trails would be welcomed by land managers.
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crn



Joined: 04 Mar 2009
Posts: 10
Location: pine plains

PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 1:34 pm    Post subject: trail building/ insurance Reply with quote

I have built 3mi (lots more to be made) of trail on my own property and would like to be able to open it up to public use, my only concern is insurance. Are there any state or local policies or incentives for private land owners allowing public use? I have searched the web, but may not be accessing the appropriate cites in regards to this. Does anyone have any suggestions?
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GoneToTheDogs?



Joined: 21 Sep 2006
Posts: 418
Location: Kingston

PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 1:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Kingdom Trails system in Vermont has many private landowners as participants. Perhaps you can contact them for info:
http://www.kingdomtrails.org/pages/about/index.htm

Russell
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sick4surf



Joined: 04 Jun 2007
Posts: 146
Location: Lawnguyland

PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 5:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Most of the Catskills is private land however, NY State decided to create a recreational use statute to allow folks to open their land to hunting and other recreational uses without fear of injury lawsuits.

Read more here:

http://www.imba.com/resources/trail_issues/land_liability.html

http://www.imba.com/resources/trail_issues/pdfs/new_york.pdf

Now back on topic...very well written policy on un-authorized trail building. It would be nice if the folks who build illegal trails can post their phone numbers so when the responsible mountain bike clubs get a phone call from the land manager's they can transfer the call.

BTW there are new fines for building illegal trails...up to $1,500 fine and you will have to restore the land back to original condition or face more fines.
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crn



Joined: 04 Mar 2009
Posts: 10
Location: pine plains

PostPosted: Fri Apr 17, 2009 3:05 pm    Post subject: multiple use Reply with quote

Thanks, this is a great help.
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mudpimp



Joined: 20 Nov 2007
Posts: 19
Location: NYC/Kerhonkson

PostPosted: Fri Apr 17, 2009 4:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Can we know where these trails are so we know not to ride them?
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D



Joined: 24 Oct 2008
Posts: 20
Location: West of the Hudson

PostPosted: Wed May 06, 2009 4:00 am    Post subject: Trail Insurance for users Reply with quote

CRN ,
Try contacting The Hudson Valley Greenway. If you are going to open them up to the public. Talk to Beth or Scott there and they may be able to point you in the right direction as to insurance etc.
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GoneToTheDogs?



Joined: 21 Sep 2006
Posts: 418
Location: Kingston

PostPosted: Mon Jun 01, 2009 6:12 pm    Post subject: Illegal Trail Building at Bluestone Reply with quote

Hey forum users and local riders,

In order to preserve access to the wonderful resource of the Catskill Park and other DEC lands, Fats in the Cats has offered to assist the DEC to educate user groups including mountain bikers.

I received the following concern from the Supervising Forester for NYS DEC Region 3 today.

The Rangers have have found new flagging and the start of a new single track type trail within Bluestone Wild Forest (includes, but is not limited to Jockey Hill and Onteora Lake). Although they haven't determined as of yet who is doing the cutting, DEC feels that the responsible thing to do is to get the word out to the user groups in the area to keep watch for illegal activities.

The Department of Environmental Conservation is taking a hard stance on illegal trail building and has significantly stepped up enforcement actions. To help facilitate good working relationships with user groups and to promote sound environmental stewardship of our lands, DEC is hoping that together, we will be able to educate all recreationists regarding appropriate use of State lands.

DEC has been very cooperative with us for many years regarding mountain bike opportunities in the region, as evidenced in the Catskill Park State Land Master Plan, several Unit Management Plans, and in multiple Stewardship Agreements. Working together, we can insure a long lasting positive relationships between DEC and mountain bikers.

If you observe or know of any illegal activity, please notify:

Jeff Rider
Supervising Forester
NYS DEC Region 3
21 S Putt Corners Rd
New Paltz, NY 12561
email: [email protected]
phone: (845)-256-3004

Thanks,

Russell
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Garron
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 12, 2009 2:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

that seems good. What kind of steps are you going to take to prevent illegal activities and under what law?
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Kevin



Joined: 09 Sep 2006
Posts: 1414
Location: Kingston

PostPosted: Fri Jun 12, 2009 6:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Education by using "Action Alert" emails and this forum are the biggest steps we can take to help prevent illegal trails. The hope is that individuals that use this website (members and non-members) will see that illegal trail building is not an accepted practice. We are a club run by volunteers, not an enforcement agency. We can not prevent individuals from doing anything.

Garron, welcome to our site. Your first post is in one of the most controversial topics this forum has ever seen. Would you care to introduce yourself?
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GoneToTheDogs?



Joined: 21 Sep 2006
Posts: 418
Location: Kingston

PostPosted: Thu Apr 01, 2010 11:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

When on what is known as the Bear Trail at Jockey Hill a week or so ago, a member noticed that a few hundred feet of trees on the ridge near where the power lines are (near the Wintergreen Loop) were marked with painted orange dots. This is not currently an authorized trail on DEC land. It does not appear that a cyclist would have done this, but since we frequent the area, if you see someone building or making in unauthorized areas, please notify DEC as mentioned earlier in this thread.

Thanks,

Russell
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